Comments on Small Biz Survival: Do the yellow pages still matter for local small b...

Hi Becky, Got it. Thanks Robert

2011-03-06T19:26:13.219-06:00

Hi Becky,

Got it. Thanks

Robert

Robert, you might talk with my friend Julie Gallag...

2011-03-06T18:32:17.252-06:00

Robert, you might talk with my friend Julie Gallagher. She does video SEO from Sacramento and the surrounding area.

Hi Becky, I've tried contacting a few folk, b...

2011-03-06T18:10:50.629-06:00

Hi Becky,

I've tried contacting a few folk, but I was unsatisfied with their service offerings...none of them had dealt with a service company before.

What kind of company would best help me?

Thanks,
Robert

Robert, while it's no longer as simple as that...

2011-03-04T14:16:36.308-06:00

Robert, while it's no longer as simple as that, there are still plenty of ways to get your local message out, online and off. I suggest you connect with some local help. You have lots of options.

Hi Becky, I'm currently a plumbing contractor...

2011-03-03T22:26:14.691-06:00

Hi Becky,

I'm currently a plumbing contractor in Washington state, had a plumbing business in rural California and Ct. I like to travel and try my luck and have the skills to do so. I have vast amount of small town plumbing biz experience.

While Google and a good website does my small town plumbing business well, it does limit expansion out of town. We did open a shop in the next county, but then Google limited exposure even further to our physical address!

The yellow pages were great for expansion. All you needed to do was put your money down and you got exposure. Now, with the limited use and rising costs of the yellow pages, expansion is proving difficult using the y.p.

For service businesses who used yellow pages to expand and contract service areas, this new market isn't fun. at. all.

Yours,
Robert

Julie, thanks for adding your experiences to the d...

2010-06-05T12:57:19.126-05:00

Julie, thanks for adding your experiences to the discussion.

Hi Becky, Stumbled across your post today --- sev...

2010-06-05T12:49:47.575-05:00

Hi Becky,

Stumbled across your post today --- several months late. If you ever want any data on yellow pages or yellowpages.com (or yp.com as it's being rebranded) fire me off an email. I was an AT&T/SBC/Pac Bell yellow page rep for 11 years and before that with one of the independents.

I took the early retirement buy out from AT&T with glee in 2008 because my customers were daily talking about how it didn't work any more. Our big customers were talking about a 30% or more decrease in their call counts - I wonder how much the counts have further decreased in the last 2 years? Another 30-40%??

If your target market is low end or low speed internet, yellow pages still works. But what used to make the yellow pages so fabulous was the ability to reach the very best customers - people with money in their pocket who wanted to buy something today - 100% of those people have abandoned yellow pages for their blackberry, iphone or high speed connection to all the info they could ever need. A web site contains way more relevant info than even the best full page ad does.

Julie

I appreciate you sharing what works in your busine...

2009-12-06T13:12:54.880-06:00

I appreciate you sharing what works in your business. It would be more helpful if you would also share what industry you are in, some idea of the size of town or market, or even some more specific results.

The Idearc media salesperson forgot to tell you on...

2009-12-06T02:19:54.551-06:00

The Idearc media salesperson forgot to tell you one small detail, they are bankrupt. They filed for bankruptcy around May of this year. Good luck trying to find your local rep, as once they have a contract they never call you back. I have found that the AT&T yellowpages still work very well for me. I had my calls tracked and found that my ROI was great. Frankly I'm happy if more and more of my competition drops out of the book and goes on the internet. That just means less competition for me. My slice of the pie just gets larger. What is so bad about that? Becky, I feel your perception is way off when it comes to advertising. Maybe all your friends don't us the phone book anymore, but you and your little group are hardly the universe.

Kevin, thanks for adding your thoughts about desig...

2009-11-08T11:34:17.530-06:00

Kevin, thanks for adding your thoughts about designing better ads.

It was very interesting reading the responses to d...

2009-11-08T08:32:42.364-06:00

It was very interesting reading the responses to date regarding the Yellow Pages. I got the impression that if a response was in favor of using the Yellow Pages, it needed to be clarified if the respondent had a big business or was located in a big city. I think that these types of clarifications are moot, at best. Bottom line is that the key to a successful ad campaign in Yellow Pages has to be the ad being placed. The message is the most importanat ingredient in obtaining any form of ROI.

One of the respondents in this artoicle said that they won't ever use Yellow Pages again because they spent $1500 and got only one customer. Gee, is that $1500 a month or a year? Did the one custome pay for the $1500 investment? Is your profit on a customer $1500 or more? Was your headline the name of your business and not what you can do for the reader researching your type of business? Was the ad a listing, several listings, and in-column ad or a display ad? 8 out of 10 who use the directory read display ads, not in column ads or listings. The reader does not care what your business name is. They care about what your business can do for them in time of needing your product or service should they choose you).

Many business owners don't take the time to talk to their yellow pages rep and tell them what it is that they want out of the ad. they don't take the time to tell the consultant what it is that makes their business different from their competitors. That's a shame. They should. It will make a big difference in results.

Also, the yellow pages is the only form of direct advertising...meaning when people are looking you up in the yellow pages, they have a buying decision in mind. All other advertising is creative (even the cover ads and specialty ads foubnd in the yellow pages...they are creative as well). Your core book ad is directive. make sure you tell the reader why they should call you. Track the ad. Don't rely on the consumer to tell you where they got your name. Some will never tell you the phone book anyway.

One last thing. Any customer you get from any of your advertising, yellow pages or other, has the ability to mention your products and services to others. In other words, yellow pages does promote referral business as well.

If you are still getting comments from customers t...

2009-08-20T21:57:28.295-05:00

If you are still getting comments from customers that they found you in the yellow pages, it's still a valid tool for you.

A local photographer told me his business performs well in the yellow pages, but only in certain markets. In south central Kansas editions, he's up against too many competitors. In southwest Kansas, he may be the only photographer and the customers, especially Hispanics, still use the phone book. So it pays to pay attention!

As another small business owner with multiple loca...

2009-08-20T19:50:59.187-05:00

As another small business owner with multiple locations in Polk County, FL, a couple of somewhat late additions to this discussion
1) whoever said business owners continue to advertise without evaluating results is correct - many do
2) on the other hand, I have indeed been a multiple-year advertising in Verizon Idearc yellow pages, and do not have access to any real measurement tools.

What is really throwing me a curve is that probably 15-25% of my customers (true, that is another guess) are over 60 and I still get lots of comments about "finding you in the yellow pages"

SO how would YOU invest your limited marketing dollars for 2010? YP or NOT??

Keith, you have a great story, with numbers to bac...

2009-08-08T17:08:18.071-05:00

Keith, you have a great story, with numbers to back it up. Thank you!

Becky - I own a small business (30 employee HVAC c...

2009-08-08T17:02:17.471-05:00

Becky - I own a small business (30 employee HVAC company) though not in a small town (Huntsville, AL). While I do think you're exactly right that yellow books -- especially the scammy marginal ones -- are of rapidly decreasing value, you really hit the nail on the head about measuring what you get for what you pay. We had decided to cancel a yellow book ad, but changed our minds and *renewed* it based on what we found when we actually looked at our call numbers: http://businessisinthedetails.com/marketing-and-selling/you-just-have-to-measure/

Thanks for sharing your experience. You must be ex...

2009-08-06T22:28:27.361-05:00

Thanks for sharing your experience. You must be exceptionally diligent about your record keeping.

Becky, I am a small business owner in a medium siz...

2009-08-06T21:58:54.665-05:00

Becky,
I am a small business owner in a medium size market. I have advertised in the yellow pages for nearly 15 years, in addition to newspapers, coupons etc.

I must agree with James Niarchos, in that I consider YP to be part of the overall advertising mix and extend the reach of all my advertising.

As a result of the negative print publicity, I recently started to carefully track all my advertising. I am utlizing unique call tracking numbers in each medium therefore I know exactly were the customer obtained my number. I have been doing this for the past 8 months. As I expected I still receive a higher ROI from the yellow pages then any other medium.

Chris, thank you for sharing exactly what I was lo...

2009-08-06T19:16:41.516-05:00

Chris, thank you for sharing exactly what I was looking for: actual experience from real small businesses.

James, well, all the best to you.

Anonymous, thanks for sharing your experience. I especially appreciate those actual figures.

Cynthia/Silver Barn, exactly. If it isn't performing for you, don't keep it.

I felt the Yellow Pages was not of benefit, but di...

2009-08-06T12:24:20.201-05:00

I felt the Yellow Pages was not of benefit, but did advertise because our competition was in there. Thanks for the insight. I'll cancel the silly thing!

I advertised my 1st in the yellow pages and I'...

2009-08-06T09:28:04.242-05:00

I advertised my 1st in the yellow pages and I'm from a big city. I got exactly one client for my $1,500. I'll never do it again- 95% of my business comes from the web ($59/year), 3% from referrals and the rest from well-placed advertising in publications that I like to support.

First of all, the whole tone of this blog is assum...

2009-08-06T08:49:09.211-05:00

First of all, the whole tone of this blog is assuming that Yellow Pages thinks it is the only medium businesses need. That is false. Yellow Pages has always been touting the value of a Marketing Mix and spoke on the ability of Yellow Pages as a medium, to extend the reach of other advertising.

Second,the claim that Yellow Pages is out to make money. Obviously, none of you have owned businesses. Of course they are out to make money! That is why people are in business! Lets not be ridiculous.

Third, a separate White Page Directoery (they are only in very large cities) is not feasible any more but it has nothing to do with Yellow Pages any more then "War and Peace".

Fourth, business people are not stupid! They don't continue to invest in the Yellow Pages every year out of habit but because it makes them a profit. The amount of calls are not like they were in the 80's for example but in many cases they still have their place.

Fifth, You think that advertisers just advertise in the Yellow Pages because their competition does? In part, you are right. It is called protecting your market share!

Sixth, the telephone companies that put out the genuine telephone book, don't have any thing to do with phony invoices. The people that do that are crooks. What does that have to do with the print directories?

Seventh, in reference to the Internet Yellow Pages, be careful. The only one worth it is YELLOWPAGES.COM It has a page ranking from ComScore that is 28!!! Out of billions of web sites on the net, they are 28th!!! Should your business be listed? That is up to you but let's all be careful that we don't let our blogs overload our.... well you know.

In summation, is being on Google important? You are damn right it is! As information, that is why the major Yellow Page publishers are all insisting that it be part of the advertisers package for success. I have stated only facts, not opinions. Thank you for the opportunity to post.

Last year I was managing a local music store. We a...

2009-08-06T08:40:30.175-05:00

Last year I was managing a local music store. We always had a yellow pages ad and got some (not tracked) business through it. When we had a change of ownership, we decided not to renew our yellow pages ad. For the next 6 months, we continued to get calls about services that were listed in the Yellow Pages that we no longer offered. The Yellow Pages were definitely driving traffic in our direction, but since it wasn't measurable, it was hard to quantify.

A local photographer who I did some web work for has similar stories. Because of the personal nature of his services, he asks EVERY customer how they heard about him. Referral and YP are the top 2.

HOWEVER... having dealt with the Yellow Pages ad people on and off for a few years, the number one selling point and justification for their cost is distribution numbers. This book goes out to 10,000 homes in this zone on the map. But with our current economy, how many homes and store fronts are empty? I wish I had taken a picture, but the shop next to mine (on both sides) had 2 different phone books hanging from door handle at one point last year. (neither of those stores had been open in the last 12 months and the one had been closed for years)
#1. How "green" is that?
#2 Those are your ad dollars going to those massive distribution numbers.

People are definitely still using the yellow pages. It isn't a total waste. But you need to look at your niche and see whether its worth it. However the publishers need to take a look at real distribution numbers. Ask me whether I want a phone book (I don't) and then reflect those new numbers to the SMB's who are advertising. A targeted list of customers who actually use those books is way better than over inflated numbers anyways.

It's a great idea, Maesz. And that is a whole ...

2009-08-06T08:19:59.848-05:00

It's a great idea, Maesz. And that is a whole 'nother topic we need to talk about!

This is slightly off topic. BUT I see a real opp...

2009-08-06T08:14:50.047-05:00

This is slightly off topic.

BUT I see a real opportunity here for some enterprising entrepreneur to walk around the business district of their own small town convincing the older, less internet savvy, small storefront business owners to enlist the entrepreneur (for a small fee, of course) to set-up social media for the store. OR (for a slightly larger fee) to teach the business owner/operator how to set-up social media AND MAINTAIN/UPDATE their sites.

Alternatively, contact your nearest vo-tech and offer to teach a class for the mature, less internet savvy storefront owner/operator. Then walk around the business district and get the business people to sign-up for the class.

2d alternative, contact your local Chamber of Commerce and offer the same services.

Become the replacement for the yellow pages!

Betsy, thanks for adding that point. One more thin...

2009-08-06T08:12:53.019-05:00

Betsy, thanks for adding that point. One more thing we need to watch out for.